N.C. State's Russell Wilson may indeed be the best quarterback in the ACC, as my colleague Luke DeCock wrote Sunday. But he's not the best quarterback in the Carolinas.
That would be Armanti Edwards, the Appalachian State junior who just might lead the Mountaineers to a fourth straight FCS national championship.
Edwards' statistics are amazing; he's the school and Southern Conference record holder for total offense, with a current career mark of 10,457 yards. And that's with at least one more playoff game and another year to go.
Despite his mind-boggling totals, you can't sum him up with numbers.
Edwards, recruited out of Greenwood High by a number of schools to play defensive back, wanted to play quarterback. Almost everyone thought that at 5-foot-11 and 160 pounds, he was too small. Appalachian gave him a chance.
Edwards has grown, he's now a legitimate 6 feet and 185 pounds. Wilson, for comparison, is 5-11 and 191, and no one says he's too small.
Edwards was, if you've forgotten, the guy who led Appalachian to its historic win at Michigan last year, throwing for three touchdowns and running for another and totaling 289 yards in Ann Arbor. He was also the guy at the controls for ASU's last two national titles.
Casual onlookers tend to think he's a running quarterback who can pass a little. Actually Edwards is brilliant in both areas; he has a strong arm and remarkable instincts—before the first of his two interceptions Saturday, he had thrown 176 passes without a pick.
And he rallied from Saturday's mistakes to throw for an Appalachian-record 433 yards in one game.
Again though, it wasn't the numbers. There was a third-and-12 play at the ASU 23, with the Mountaineers clinging to a three-point lead and their momentum dieing. Just before he was sacked, Edwards threw the ball—somehow—to receiver T.J. Courman, who caught it and wriggled to the 36 for a first down that eventually led to a score.
I've seen most of his games—either live or on TV—this season, and Edwards seems to make a similar play in just about every narrow Appalachian victory.
You think South Carolina coach Steve Spurrier, who could have had him, would have taken him Saturday against Clemson?
Don't be too hard on Spurrier; the other six Carolinas' BCS schools missed too.
They put him into that cornerback box, if they thought of him at all.
And I promise you, they lost a shot at the best quarterback in the Carolinas.
At any level.
- Stan Olson
Monday, December 1, 2008
Best QB in Carolinas is in Boone
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125 comments:
I am not even going to say a word. This has GOT to be a joke. Isn't Russell and freshman and won ALL ACC QB in the ACC!!! seriously are you delusional?
Edwards is definitely the best because he has been doing it for years. Wilson hasn't even played a whole season yet. Teams still have plenty of time to figure out a game plan for WIlson and shut him down. If teams haven't figured out how to stop Edwards yet they never will. You could never convince a State fan of that fact though, they want to believe they have at least one successful person in their athletic program.
Yosef sounds like he has some emotional issues of his own to work through.
Anyway, I'm an NC State graduate, and Wilson is a beast. But I can't really argue with the Edwards pick. He has been doing it for years.
However, aside from the Michigan game, what has Edwards ever done against good D1-A/FBS competition? I'm not taking anything away from Edwards, but 90% of the games he's played have been against subpar D1-AA/FCS opponents. I'm sure Russell Wilson, Riley Skinner, TJ Yates, Thaddeus Lewis and Patrick Pinkney could all do very well if they played 90% of their college careers against a bunch of cupcakes.
At first I thought I must be reading a story on the Rock Hill Herald's website because this sounds like something Darin Gantt would write.
Jimmy, Edwards has had only 2 chances against FBS teams, so those numbers aren't apparent. Stephen, get out of your narrow-minded NC State bubble. Edwards has 6,778 passing yards for 61 TDs, 3,679 rushing yards for 46 TDs, 160 Passer Rating, has rushed for 313 yards in one game (Richmond in final round of 2007 playoffs). He only needs 62 more yards to have 3 consecutive 1000 yard rushing seasons. I don't remember Russell leading his team to a national championship his freshman year. Yeah yeah, he's in the FBS, but so are his receivers and his offensive line and his defense. All of App is in the FCS, and he's STILL amassed these numbers. He's a finalist for the Payton award, look it up. He's an all Southern Conference player, and has the highest passer rating in the FCS. We aren't even a pass-first team. Maybe you should look up some videos on youtube before you decide that this is a "joke."
You are all over it...Edwards IS the best in NC...Wilson has the tools to be special but Edwards has been doing it for years now. If you don't believe me watch for yourself this Saturday @ noon on ESPN. App vs Richmond in Round 2 of the playoffs.....playoffs, what a great concept!!
Ha! Typical dumba$$ NC State fan...Russell Wilson has a load of potential but has accomplished zilch at the helm of the Wolfpack. The team is 6-6 and may not even make a bowl-how does this give Wilson any credibility? And as far as Russel Wilson and Riley Skinner go, they play in the ACC, so they HAVE been playing cupcakes. Not one of those guys would have had a snowball's chance in hell at beating the #5 ranked Wolverines last year, but Armanti ran and passed through them with ease.
Likewise, before you write off FCS teams as
"cupcakes," don't forget ASU thrashed Richmond and Delaware, two teams that featured a first-round QB in Joe Flacco and Tim Hightower, the starting running back for the Arizona Cardinals.
There is a reason that neither NC State nor UNC would play ASU when offered the chance prior to the season....
Edwards is good and has monster numbers, but he's playing against guys that are several notches below his talent level. 433 yards against SC State isn't the same as even a crappy league like the ACC. Don't get me wrong - he could definitely play D1 QB and do it well, but not at the level he does in the minors. There's a lot more speed in the bigs.
Kyle, That was very good stuff. Matthew, that was pretty good as well.
ACC is "CUPCAKE"! They won't accept APP State's offer to play!!
Edwards is on track to pass Randel El for most total combined yards by a D1 quarterback! And is the first quarterback since Tony Romo from the FCS to mentioned in the Heisman discussion.
IF App wins it's 4 Championship, then Armanti lights it up in Greenville next Sept. He will be on the ballot next year!
Not sure who wrote this column... But, I would just like to say... I appreciate your expert knowledge and comprehensive background on the subject!
AE, is a Defense's WORST nightmare!!
IF you put him behind a BcS schools O Line he would be an elite QB in the BcS. That was a period at the end of that last sentence!
We seem to keep getting hung up on the point that AE plays against "sub par D1-AA teams" lest we forget that the teammates that Mr. Edwards relies on are part of that same level. Appalachian does not have many star receivers, and yet Edwards confidently puts it into their hands for over 433 yards? Incredible by any standards.
Wilson was incredibly efficient, but I was glad to see that Thaddeus Lewis of Duke received second-team honors. Wilson probably had the best year, but Lewis is the most accomplished QB in the ACC, and it's nice to see him get some recognition even though he toils in obscurity at Duke.
I am an NCSU alum. I have seen Wilson play live twice this year - I have seen Edwards several times in the past 3 years. Armanti was better as a true freshman than Russell is now. Decision making tops the list, then the arm strength, then the rushing ability. I think Russell can get there, but he is not there yet.
Those of you that think the FCS is full of cupcakes, think again. Just look at the Sagrin Ratings. Just this week NCSU eeked out ASU by a couple of points. JMU is higher than the Pack. The top 10 FCS teams are better than 50% of FBS teams. No question about that.
You can even ask a smart APP STATE fan and they will tell you that if mr. edwards played in a big conference where he got hit a lot more by big guys he wouldn't be able to play every game. I think you guys forgot the last couple of years that APP State played big time schools they might have won or played well but then he didn't even play the next game. As for being an nc state homer...check this fact out---nc state SUCKED and was 3-8 the year they played App State, App state WON their national championship that year....anyone want to remind us what the final score was? Thought so.
Stephen, you are the one that is delusional!! Obviously you are indeed a State grad, b/c your grammar gave you away. The only reason why you as a State fan have any say-so in this deal is b/c you all beat us 3 years ago. I have news for you though, AE didn't play in that game and it was still close. So, I guess we will never know how he would do against your beloved Wolfpuppies b/c you will not play us anymore.
No matter what you and the rest of the App Haters think of AE, he could definitely play on the FBS level and he would still put up great numbers. You can tune into ESPN Classic on occasion to witness his skills against Michigan at the Big House if you like. AE made them look so bad that they had to go out and find a coach that runs the same offense that App runs. Matter of fact, Jerry Moore learned the spread offense from Rich Rodriguez!! I bet he wishes he had AE on his team right now.
AE's numbers do not do him justice, but I will take 10,000 plus combined yards and 100 TD's in 3 years any day. Just so you know Stephen, App is still playing this year and we are well on our way to a 4-Peat!! The great thing about all of this is that AE has another year to prove his talent and put up ridiculous numbers. Tell Russell Wilson to stay healthy so we can continue this conversation next year. Meanwhile, I will be back in Chattanooga with the boys witnessing one more time, the "Wizzud" making history.
App Grad '96
Hey Reply, know who DIDN'T start the NCSU game in 2006? True freshman Armanti Edwards!!! If Armanti starts,different ballgame. App lost 23-10 and you can't convince me that if Armanti played it wouldn't have been different.That being said,if you want to continue bringing up the 06' NCSU game as some sort of badge of honor or some sort of a cheap shot to diminish our national championships,it just shows you the current state of NCSU football. You guys can keep harping about your win in 2006. We will be busy preparing to defend our national title in the quarterfinals against Richmond this week. Enjoy the MagicJack Bowl or whatever 11AM start time bowl game you get in front of thousands of empty seats. App will be playing in the friendly confines in The Rock in front of 20,000 people in a game with some real championship implications
Enough said Murph!!
Pack fans, you go play in your Poulan Weedeater dot.com bowl on the blue turf in Boise and we will head on up to Chattanooga to complete our 4-Peat!!
With the current economics in college sports, we play the hand we are dealt. Give us a couple more years of winning Championships and we will be in the FBS. That way, there will be no more questions surrounding our so called "JV" status.
BRING IT ON!!!
App Grad '96
App St. fans are living in a little fantasy world up there on their mountain of solitude. That's awesome that Armanti is padding his stats against South Carolina State and Elon. When the dude gives an interview he can hardly string a competent sentence together. It's nice he's able to take basket-weaving at a second rate institution. I'm sure his course work is tremendous. State would beat App like a red-headed step child. If you've won 3 straight JV titles, it is time to move up to Varsity. Damn, I wish Lee Fowler would schedule App to shut this bull crap up.
"There is a reason that neither NC State nor UNC would play ASU when offered the chance prior to the season...."
NC State did play App...and one of Chuck Amato's worst teams ever worse out the Mountaineers.
Also its pretty hilarious to see the App State homers pump up the 1-AA as being quality opponents. Keep holding onto that Michigan win, because everyone else in 1-A wears you out. Every time you play a 1-A team who isn't a slow overrated Michigan team, you lose. But honestly it is funny. Keep hyping up your cupcake conference and taking jabs at State and Carolina and Duke and ECU and other programs that actually play college football.
The only thing 1-AA has going for them is their postseason playoffs (which are great). Other than that, they are JV talent. Thats why LSU wore out App, thats why NC State wore out App, etc. Because you play junior varsity football. Your delusions are funny though, keep them coming.
The ridiculous comments being spewed by ASU fans on here has me further convinced that the best green is in fact in Boone, NC.
Here are the porous arguments as to why Armanti Edwards, who is easily the best player in FCS/I-AA, is not better the best QB in the Carolinas:
(1)Compared to the ACC, Armanti Edwards plays against weaker competition.
(2) He gets injured against LSU and Michigan, so he couldn't handle "big boy" defenses. (3) For all ASU's success since '05, its supposedly best team's only loss in 2006 was to a 3-9 NCSU team.
Folks, those arguments are weaker than Wachovia stock in September.
The weaker competition argument is ludicrous. Level of competition doesn't matter for truly great players. FOUR of the past 10 NFL MVP's came from FCS teams: Warner ('99 & '01), Gannon ('02), and McNair ('03). FOUR!!! Nor does college competition matter for 3 of this year's possible Pro Bowl QB's (Warner, Romo, and Joe Flacco, who was outperformed by Edwards last year in the FCS title game).
As a college quarterback, AE has been BETTER than any of those guys. He's the only one who's won 2 straight natonal titles, and he very well could get 2 more. And this article more than demonstrates his accomplishments and playmaking abilities.
The Armanti-gets-injured argument is also silly. Michael Vick, best running QB ever, would have gotten injured playing against LSU or Michigan behind ASU's O-line, which is decent by FCS standards but indeed too small for most BCS defenses. AE's health would be fine against the ACC behind an ACC-sized line.
The NCSU game is irrelavant. That's an NCSU vs. ASU argument, not Wilson vs. Edwards. Besides, neither player started in that game, and it was Edwards' first game ever.
Let's look even closer...
Would it be "delusional" to suggest that AE won't achieve the same things in the NFL that other form I-AA QB's have? Not entirely, but I certainly hope he does. After all, he is one of the best people on and off the field in college football.
But the main point of the article is simply that Armanti Edwards, the surefire Payton Award winner, is better than any other college QB in the Carolinas, including the first-team All-ACC QB. When you look at the evidence rationally, it's a no-brainer. AE is as good as it gets, and it's not even close.
Here's some more arguments as to why Armanti Edwards isn't the best QB in the Carolinas:
"Every time you play a 1-A team who isn't a slow overrated Michigan team, you lose."
~Didn't this overrated Michigan team go 8-4, finish ranked 15th, beat Heisman-winning Tim Tebow's Gators, and have a bunch of guys drafted? And, yes, with smaller O- and D-Lines, we normally lose to teams with 22 more scholarships and 100X more national exposure, although going 4-for-12 against Wake Forest was enough for them to ban us from their schedule. What's any of that got to do with Armanti Edwards abilities as a QB?
"The ridiculous comments being spewed by ASU fans on here has me further convinced that the best green is in fact in Boone, NC."
~Wow! Now that's a convincing argument! It reminds of what the kids teach in 3rd grade: When you can't prove your point using a rational argument, just insult people.
"It's nice he's able to take basket-weaving at a second rate institution. I'm sure his course work is tremendous."
~He's majoring in Graphic Arts and Imaging Technology and has consistently made the Dean's List. Most football players at ASU have no choice but to take their majors seriously since their pro prospects are almost nil. However, I'm sure State and UNC have outstanding General Studies programs for their academically enlightened football players. But, once again, what does any of that have to do with whether Armanti Edwards is the best QB in the Carolinas?
"When the dude gives an interview he can hardly string a competent sentence together."
~He's one of the most humble and polite athletes in college sports today. For a young man who endured the heartbreak of watching his father get sent to prison on the day of his first-ever college game, it's everything you could ask for. Rather than choosing rage, bitterness, and drugs in response to his hardship, he's turned to his coaches for guidance and emerged as an astonishing success on the field and in class. But keep insulting him if it makes you feel better sitting behind your laptop.
Hey fellow ASU fans,
Spare the insults towards State, ECU, and UNC and their oddball-named bowl games. Instead, use that Appalachian State education to make a common sense case for why Armanti Edwards is better than their quarterbacks are. The evidence is more than in our favor--the dude's as good as they come. If they insult us with comments like "JV" and "delusional" without making any case for why Wilson, Lewis, Harper, or anybody else is better, it means that they know we're right, and they're bitter. We absolutely have the best quarterback in the Carolinas.
Would anyone even dare to make a case using this thing called logic for any QB they think is better in these two states? You can spare me the "any ACC player could put up those numbers against that weak competition." Ryan Perilloux, the #1-rated QB coming out of high school in 2005 who transferred from LSU to Jacksonville State, couldn't come close to AE's numbers against an even weaker conference this year, and Perilloux is a much better talent than any current FBS QB in the Carolinas.
You guys are totally missing the argument about Armante Edwards and FCS levels of competition. Notable FCS quarterbacks of recent note include: Tony Romo, Kurt Warner, Joe Flacco. Statistically Armante is ahead of all these individuals and has another year to play in the FCS. He gets the best game the other defense can put on the field every week and still delivers exceptional numbers.
Thank you Observer for going beyond the ACC hype and looking at reality. AE is not just good he is very good!....and he has another year plus at least one game to go.
Why didn't he get an offer to play in the ACC if he is that good? Not comparing apples to apples. Edwards is good for the division he is but come on.
Edwards wouldn't even Start at NC State, UNC, or Wake. I'm dead serious. If he played D-1 competition every week, then he would not have these kind of stats. He just flat out wouldn't start anywhere else. App couldn't beat anyone in the ACC. LSU isn't even a good team and they beat APP like a drum. It wasn't even close. Take off your black and gold tinted glasses and come back to reality. You will see next year when they lose to ECU to open the season.
This is comical to watch everyone bicker back and forth. Fact of the matter is that Armanti is an outstanding player on and off the field and has consistently put up eye popping numbers. I know NC State has much bigger and faster players than FCS as my brother played football at NC State for 3 years. But there is no doubt in my mind that Armanti couldn't humiliate all of the ACC with a decent D1-A offense surrounding him. This NCSU beat App already so you can shut up crap is getting older than the talk about Michigan...get over yourselves state fans. That was in 2006, we historically play much worse at the beginning of our season, Armanti did not start, and hell you only won by 13, with 7 of those coming last in the game. So please spare me the "we throttled App" comments about the 06 game. Bottom line is that Armanti is levels above any QB in the state at this point in time. He is a genius at decision making and is a true leader on the field. I haven't seen a QB with his vision on the field since Phillip Rivers. Please why can't all of us App and State fans just get along and hate Carolina...Thats all I have to say.
Be realistic ACC fans... Armanti Edwards will be considered one of the greatest, if not THE GREATEST, player in the history of FCS/I-AA. This is a division that has seen the likes of Jerry Rice, Walter Payton, Terrell Owens, Randy Moss, Brian Westbrook, Tony Romo, Kurt Warner, Steve McNair, Rich Gannon, and countless other All Pro NFL players. Take a look at your favorite team's roster and see how many I-AA/FCS players are on it... you'll be suprised.
Discounting his abilities and suggesting that he would be an average player in the ACC only displays your false perception of the talent difference between the subdivisions and your overall lack of knowledge of college football.
Rhett Bomar and Ryan Perrilloux, #1 QBs in 04/05 coming out of HS, cannot come close to accomplishing what AE has done in his three years on the mountain.
App fans, this is why you're beginning to push the annoyance level of UNC fans. Don't let your arrogance and over-inflated self opinion overrun the great team you guys have put together. App is a great 1-AA team, but the fact of the matter is that they could not play at the 1-A level week in and week out. Against LSU this year (a team that is only 7-5 overall), your team lost 41-13 while Edwards was 13-of-31 passing (29.5% comp.) for 155 yards and a touchdown and had 12 carries for 23 yards.
I have great respect for Appalachian State and what they have accomplished on their level, but can we please put to rest the "App is the best team in the state/nation/world/galaxy" stuff. Over-arrogance from the fan base is a quick way to lose the respect your team has worked so hard to gain.
I love it...someone from the school that gave us Chris "Amphibious" Washburn, TA McClendon and an Alumnus Head Basketball Coach, who actually never graduated, criticizing App's curriculum.
FYI - Armanti is a Graphic Arts and Imaging Technology major, which I am pretty sure they offer at NC State as well.
Russell Wilson has been a great addition to NC State, but Armanti's intangibles are through the roof. It has nothing to do with competition, but the fact that he has come through, time and again, when the spotlight shone the brightest.
Right now, he's the best QB in the Carolinas. Period. Does that mean he's the most talented, or plays in the toughest league? No...it just means he's proved it on the field more often than anyone else in the region.
The only way resolve this dispute is to put the 2 teams on the same field. So heres what should be done. Since NC State won't have a game in December, they should call up the mountain and schedule the NC State Championship game with Appalachian of course after App wins it's 4th straight National Championship!
To the anonymous post talking about Edward's ability to give an interview and his apparent basket weaving class schedule... That is just classless. You know absolutely nothing about the guy and have no right to say such a thing about him. If you want to make a football related argument, fine, but garbage like that is completely unnecessary.
"App St. fans are living in a little fantasy world up there on their mountain of solitude. That's awesome that Armanti is padding his stats against South Carolina State and Elon. When the dude gives an interview he can hardly string a competent sentence together. It's nice he's able to take basket-weaving at a second rate institution. I'm sure his course work is tremendous. State would beat App like a red-headed step child. If you've won 3 straight JV titles, it is time to move up to Varsity. Damn, I wish Lee Fowler would schedule App to shut this bull crap up."
This two-degree holding professional from this "second rate institution" takes serious offense at your pompous insinuation that Appalachian is somehow and in someway second rate to your brick and morter NC State. Maybe both you and Lee Fowler are just full of the "bull crap"?? Good luck to the Pack in postseason...
It's about talent. Edwards has D-1 talent but is playing D-2 or FCS. Football athletes are judged on size and speed. If he comes up a level, I am not so sure that his talent makes up for his lack of accuracy. We will see if the pro's gamble on him. Either way - both are good.
You can't take one win over 2 years ago and a 10 point win over William & Mary and claim that NC State is head and shoulders above the FCS. But, that has nothing to do with this story. Its about one position.
Would Armanti Edwards start over TJ Yates at UNC or Russell Wilson at NC State? No. The UNC and NC State offenses don't fit his style of play. Would TJ Yates or Russell Wilson start over Armanti Edwards at Appalachian St? No.
Appalachian State runs a spread offense while UNC and NC State run a more traditional pro-style offense.
With injuries taking away our top 3 running backs, Armanti leads App in rushing by twice as much as the next player. He 39 total TDs, he's passed for 29 TDs to only 4 INTs. He's completed 64 % of his passes. He has over 3500 total yards.
Wilson does have a very impressive TD to INT ratio of 16 to 1. He has 20 total TDs (slightly more than half of Armanti's total). He has 2111 total yards (60 % of Armanti's total). He has completed 55 % of his passes (9 % less than Armanti).
Maybe Armanti wouldn't put up the same numbers in the ACC, but if he could get half of them, he'd be right there with the All-ACC qb.
Don't know how the durability question can come up. Russell Wilson was knocked out of the first game of the year. TJ Yates missed several games. Armanti missed one, and was ready to play if needed.
As far as the big time/small time argument...Stephen Curry vs. Tyler Hansborough.
You could make an argument for either, with most people leaning towards Tyler.
The difference?
He's probably the best player in the nation. Nobody is saying Armanti is a Tebow or McCoy. He's just better than your sorry ACC.
Prove me wrong...play us. Enough fo the William & Mary/ McNeese State BS.
WOW! Edwards and ASU must be pretty good to get this much sports hate.
im sorry but isnt ncstate the worst team in the acc-atlantic?
the worst team in a crappy conference is ragging on how we performed against lsu on opening day AT lsu in whats suppose to be a down year for us?
lsu is 7-5 in the SEC
YOU ALL ARE 6-6 IN THE ACC
you dont compare to lsu.
our team is just starting to gell after losing pretty much all of its playmakers on both sides of the ball last season.
Tony Romo, TO, Randy Moss, Tyler Thigpen ... all NFL starters. And they played in the "minors."
Let's see what happens in Greenville 2009. At least the Pirates don't mind a challenge.
Edwards is running up some great stats against 240 lb defensive linemen and 5'8" defensive backs. As previous poster stated, Edwards would spend a lot of time injured if ASU played a Div. IA schedule.
ASU needs to sack up and play in the big leagues, instead of hiding in I-AA. Good gosh, they gave up 24 points to Campbell last week...Campbell!
Stan, I believe you are showing your Carolina Blue undies on this one. Had that been TJ Yates as 1st team All ACC, I wonder if this column would have been written at all? Could it be a little ax grinding going on towards the boys in red that wore out the baby blue? By the way, Edwards is a great QB as is Wilson.
CAMPBELL?!
when did we play campbell? ignorant.
"I am not so sure that his talent makes up for his lack of accuracy"
Really??? Edwards leads the NCAA in passing efficiency(178.99) with a 64% completion rate.
For the Sate fans who believe their University's academics are much better than Appalachian's...I have several friends who applied to both State and Appalachian. They go to State now because they got rejected by Appalachian.
Ok, they didn't play Campbell. Instead they played heavyweights like Jacksonville, Presbyterian, Samford, and Wofford. I saw the Wofford game - that team didn't have a defensive player over 240 lbs.
app fans need to stop talking out of their a@s. Again, sack up and play 12 Div IA teams a year - then we'll see what they're made of.
The reality is this: Duke would compete for a Div. IAA title every year. That ought to put things in its proper perspective.
success breeds envy...
"app fans need to stop talking out of their a@s. Again, sack up and play 12 Div IA teams a year - then we'll see what they're made of."
That would be more than State played...
To the latest "anonymous"
I'm not a fan of the transitive property of sport but don't use Wofford as your reason App has a lame schedule. They lost to South Carolina 13-23. The same South Carolina that beat you 34-0. The same Wofford we beat 70-24. Look up and down an ACC team's schedule, you'll see a close game against an FCS opponent.
Great article on a great QB!
GO APPS!
KMA - don't forget, he's so inaccurate that he's thrown 4 INTs in 14 games this year, and 2 of those were last week.
Those who don't watch him see his great running plays, but don't realize that he has developed into a great passer as well. 29-41 for 433 and 4 TDs are not "Option QB" numbers.
1 more year and this argument will be over and the ACC folks can go back to thinking that the best Division I football quarterback in NC plays somewhere on Tobacco Road.
In the meantime, AE is likely to finish off this year as the 2nd player in all of college football, and the first in Division I, to pass for 2000 yds and run for 1000 in a single season-- TWICE.
He has amassed over 10,000 yards of total offense in 3 years.
Why the hate and vitriol? Enjoy the show...poor lil ole ASU is no threat to the mighty ACC.
To all those "play 12 Div IA teams and we'll talk" folks-- fine, give us the full allotment of scholarships and our share of the crapulent BCS money as well.
What ACC fans should really be asking themselves is why, with so much talent, aren't ACC teams racking up BCS championships and major bowl appearances? It's amazing how NCSU and UNC produce so many NFL players with so little to show for it in the trophy room.
Just relax, enjoy the AE show for one more year, and be sure to support your team in whatever meaningless bowl game it gets invited to.
What is the problem with everyone today?? First of all, State and App don't play each other, so let's stop comparing the 2. Second of all, both QBs are good in their own right. AE has more experience, so I highly expect that he should be better at this point in his game. Russel Wilson deserves credit for the fact that as a red shirt freshman he has 226 passes without an interception... that's 2nd in the history of NCAA football. So yes, he's good also, and he'll continue to get better the more experience he has, just like AE has since he was a freshman. Talking trash to each other makes no other point than your inability to accept an opinion different than your own and the fact that someone else playing for a different team than your own might also be good. Grow up people.
OK, let's try and get back on track here. Noone is saying "ASU is the greatest in the nation/world/universe", we are talking about AE. Now, as a former college player and coach, you have to put all of this in the proper perspectives. ASU played poorly against LSU, granted...but given the o-line and surroundings of the average ACC team and I believe anyone would agree that AE would make it a competetive game. My fellow NCSU fans point out the less than stellar numbers of AE in that game, and LSU's 7-5 record as if LSU is a subpar team. As an NCSU football graduate, I have to point out that there is NO way we could hang with LSU, NO way. LSU is well below their average year, and they would still win the ACC, thats just the facts. Against us in '06, ASU was in the game the whole time and played very well. AE got in the last few plays at the end of the game. Even ASU had no idea they had lightning in a bottle then. I have had the opportunity to watch both AE and Wilson play and have met both young men. I am hopeful that Wilson is the answer to our struggles of the last 5+ years, and he is a good kid and a good talent with GREAT potential. That being said, NCSU fans need to understand that many players have had potential, and that means squat. If Wilson ends up being 75% of the player that AE is now, we will have a return to greatness.
Now, for the unknowledgable fan who said, "Why didn't he get an offer to play in the ACC if he is that good? Not comparing apples to apples." That is such a terrible argument. For one, coaches miss great players all the time. "Why did Wilson not get offers to UCLA, Michigan or Notre Dame if he is so good?" (all top FBS programs but playing subpar now like the ACC)would be an equilivant argument. Read the article, AE was recruited by FBS schools (Clemson, et al) as a DB due to his size (though he is taller in person by more than an inch over Wilson). Romo, Warner, Gannon, Jerry Rice, Walter Payton, Matt Birk, Brian Westbrook, Brandon Jacobs, Randy Moss, Terrell Owens, Donald Driver, Marques Colston, Aeneus Williams, Albert Lewis, Rodney Harrison, Terrance McGee, Nate Newton, Mark Schlereth, Richard Dent, Michael Strahan, Clyde Simmons, Marcellus Wiley, Jared Allen, Kimo van Oelhoffen, Osi Umenyiora, etc. etc. etc. are all guys that obviously must be subpar players under your argument since they were not recruited by FBS schools. I received my graduate degree from ASU after playing at NCSU, so I'm pretty unbiased here. There is good reason that we have turned down the opportunity to play ASU the last 2 years. UNC and Wake have refused as well. I have no doubt that if AE was were he was at the end of '06 and had started that game, we would not have won. AE is the best QB in the Carolinas and there is NO rational argument against it by any one how knows anything about college football. Ask a player/coach or former player/coach and they should set you straight.
Also, for those of you that got off subject by arguing about academics or AE's intelligence, let me tell you, as a former student of both universities, outside of the engineering department, NCSU alumni and students don't want to "go there". ASU's average SAT's have been just ahead or just behind NCSU for the last decade or so, and the estimates for next year but ASU firmly ahead. We need to step it up. On campus, ASU is much more of an "academic institution" than State was when I was there.
Also, AE is a VERY intelligent young man. He speaks in the dialect and accent that any young man from his neighborhood in Greenwood would. He is taking a real major and on the Dean's list. ASU does not have the program that NCSU has, and had when I played there, for hand-holding the football players through school. ASU's admission standards for athletes is also MORE, much more actually, difficult than the NCAA minimums so many NCSU players would not qualify to play at App. NCSU should follow suit, and I have no doubt O'Brien has probably already started the process, to follow suit. I would rather have another season or two of .500 ball and get real "students" in there than continue with some of the academic travisties that we have had on the field during the Amato era. I can say with the utmost certainity, after looking at some of the, ahem, "scholars" that I played with at State, Wolfpackers do NOT want to make this argument!
I have played and coached college ball in the past, I have seen many great QB's in my day. Now the "system" that AE plays in allows him to put up the numbers that he does. In the system that Philip Rivers played in, AE could not have matched Rivers numbers, and on the flip-side of that, Rivers could never match AE's numbers in the spread, irregardless of the level of play. With all that said, Edwards is the one of the two best QB's to attend a college in the carolinas in the last 20 years, with apologies to David Garrard and Charlie Whitehurst. Now I do not, however, believe he will be an NFL QB, but neither has Randle El, Hines Ward, etc. We are talking about QB's at the COLLEGE level, not as pro prospects. As far as a dual threat QB, he's the best I have ever seen in the Carolinas and, though smaller, he is equal to Vick in running and far superior as an accurate passer and decision-making, though his arm strength is less(but as his 65 yard-in-the-air pass on Halloween night shows, he still has plenty of arm).
For the guy, Jimmy, who said, "Every time you play a 1-A team who isn't a slow overrated Michigan team, you lose." God I hope your not a fellow State grad, b/c you are an embarassment to us all. That slow overrated Michigan team finished in the top 15, beat the stuffings out of Florida in their bowl and thats the same Florida team that beat FSU, who beat the crap out of us, 45-12 last year. That Wofford team that ASU embarassed on national TV 70-24 this year had just 1 other regular season loss this year and that was a close game, in which Wooford lead late in the game, only to lose by ten to USC, the same USC that we could not stop and could not move the ball against in the 1st game of the year (34-0). Now some fellow state alums like to point out that Wilson was not our starter then and only played a limited number of snaps, it was his 1st ever college game, and if we played that game again it would be a different game and we would win. Well all of those argument also apply to that'06 game we keep bringing up as proof we are far superior to ASU. AE's first game, wasn't the starter, and played even fewer snaps than Wilson did, and App only lost by 13 and it was closer than that. We lost by 34 to USC and it wan't that close. I don't see where we have alot to argue with. BTW NCSU is the "FBS" state champion, and until our adminstration has the guts to play App again we need to keep that distinguished as such. As a former player, I am embarassed that we have ducked them this year, and Chapel Hill fans should be doublely emabarassed b/c after saying they couldn't schedule another FCS team and all other kinds of excuses that they gave to Jay Sutton at ASU, they turn around and scheduled McNeese State, an inferior FCS team. I have confidence in my team that we could play ASU and be successful. I can tell you that after speaking with some in our administration, they do not share my faith.
Edwards and his team will come to Greenville next fall thinking they will actually win, but will leave utterly dejected.
NCSU Alum here again - the average SAT and GPA for entering freshman was higher at ASU than NCSU this year. I have 3 in college: one at UNC, one at ASU, and one at NCSU. All are fine academic institutions.
AE is the better QB. No question.
Stan thanks for the article. Saw an assistant coach for Wake Forest in a hotel gym while traveling this year and asked him why ASU did not have Wake on the schedule any longer. Quote "no way we will play ASU until Armante is gone." Pretty strong endorsement from a guy that obviously knows football and who coaches in a pretty decent ACC football program.
Why did this suddenly turn to academics? The minimum GPA and SAT scores are rising for all UNC system schools each year. ASU, UNC, NCSU... they all offer different things for different people. None is better than the other. Let's get back to football.
thank you, BigManOnCampus, for your very insightful and thoughtful comments.
i, for one, am ready for round two of the FCS playoffs. at least in that arena you witness a true system of crowning a champion. irregardless of what happens this December, AE and his former and current teammates have helped give APP and it's faithful a lot to be grateful for and proud of...It's Great to be a Mountaineer!
Funny that NC state fans comment on how LSU beat App this year, but they forget that they also lost their battle with the SEC this year too. Remember that one? 34-ZERO against South Carolina. However you did win 6 cupcake games in the ACC.
finally a sports writer in north carolina that gets it...
if you unc, ncsu and wake fans are so tough then why the hell won't you schedule us. because you know we will ruin your season.
i'd rather be an fcs champion than a bcs coward.
go mountaineers
Superman wears Armanti Edwards pajamas!
BigmanonCampus,
Very good post. Verbose, but full of relavent information. I won't get into academics, as I think that has been covered, State and ASU both have some very good programs. A very good friend of mine did his graduate work (in Acct.) at ASU, so NCSU has become my defacto favorite ACC team (take that with a grain of salt). Wilson is a great talent, but hes just not on the level of AE yet, and he might not ever be. AE brings the intangibles, in boatloads. He almost always makes the right decision. He is without a doubt the toughest person I have ever encountered, constantly shrugging off hits that would fell a fullback. (and to those people that say 240 pound Dlinemen and 5'8'' corners, get a clue, one of the best corners to ever play at ASU was 5'5'', he stopped NFL bound Mario Manningham all day, I think he only had 3 catches and only one of them was relavent in the game) Look at the highlights of the ASU-Wofford game and watch AE sling a 65 yard pass over the outstretched hands of two defenders. Don't hate on the competition either, 99% of us that post on this don't have the talent or desire to play at a D-III school,much less at ASU or NCSU, most of you have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about when you call FCS "JV". Give ASU the extra 22 schollies, and we recruit guys that fit our system just like the ones we have now, and we would be competing for the ACC championship this year, and AE would be All-ACC two times running.
Just a reminder to my fellow ASU fans: your suggestions that the ACC sucks simply does not hold water. The ACC may not have any teams comparable to Florida, Alabama, Texas, or Oklahoma, but it does have 8 or 9 teams on par with Ole Miss, LSU, and Missouri.
This year, only the Big 12 was better than the ACC. I'll prove it...
No conference won more non-conference games than the ACC ACC. Even more impressive, the ACC also had the most non-conference wins games against other BCS conference teams (i.e., the SEC, Big 12, Pac-10, Big Ten, & Big East). Outside of three games against Florida and Alabama, the ACC destoyed the SEC.
Now that I've said that, let's remember that the ACC's strength has nothing to do with the subject of this article: Armanti Edwards' abilities as a QB.
Nice comment:
"To all those "play 12 Div IA teams and we'll talk" folks-- fine, give us the full allotment of scholarships and our share of the crapulent BCS money as well."
It misses the point. App chose to go to Div IAA back in the late 70's. They made that choice. No one made them take a scholarship reduction - perhaps they simply don't have the financial support to fund enough scholarships for a Div IA program. Wonder why, despite all their IAA titles and wins, they're still playing in a 25k seat stadium?
Join the FBS, you'll get the same share of BCS money as Sunbelt and CUSA teams.
"Ok, they didn't play Campbell. Instead they played heavyweights like Jacksonville, Presbyterian, Samford, and Wofford. I saw the Wofford game - that team didn't have a defensive player over 240 lbs.
app fans need to stop talking out of their a@s. Again, sack up and play 12 Div IA teams a year - then we'll see what they're made of.
The reality is this: Duke would compete for a Div. IAA title every year. That ought to put things in its proper perspective."
~That's a good, whiny rant, but what does that have to do with Armanti Edwards? Oh wait... I get it: You lack the ability to name any reasons why Russell Wilson is better than AE, so instead you argue why NCSU is better than ASU, which is a debate for other forums, anyway. Isn't that like arguing that the anonymous QB's who won LSU's national titles are better than Jay Cutler? After all, Cutler's team wasn't as good.
Great debate, and I loved BigMan's post. You truly have to see AE to appreciate him. Had an ACC assistant (not from State or NC) tell me yesterday that AE could have started for them this season and they would have won several more games...
why is it so hard for fans of ACC teams to say "yes, the best college quarterback in the state happens to play in Boone"?
why all this "yeah but" and "if if if"?
it's either jealousy or elitism or some sick combination of both.
get over yourself already. the player in question has done nothing to bring this on-- except play.
"It misses the point. App chose to go to Div IAA back in the late 70's. They made that choice. No one made them take a scholarship reduction - perhaps they simply don't have the financial support to fund enough scholarships for a Div IA program. Wonder why, despite all their IAA titles and wins, they're still playing in a 25k seat stadium?
Join the FBS, you'll get the same share of BCS money as Sunbelt and CUSA teams."
That's a good point, but the issue is extremely complex. ASU would have to ask itself, "Which former I-AA champion would we resemble as an FBS team: a great Boise State team, a relatively obscure Marshall or Nevada, or an embarassment to its former self like Western Kentucky?" Most former FCS teams have struggled enormously, with extra exposure being perhaps the only redeeming quality.
There are many, many more layers to the issue. Yes, annual games against Marshall and ECU would be great, but C-USA would be more of a longshot. Compared to our current regular season, which is filled with deep-seated rivalries against schools which actually has students/alumni we personally know, a Sun Belt schedule against North Texas, MTSU, La.-Lafayette, and FIU would be a letdown. We know it'd take 10-15 years before an ACC or SEC team would man up enough to come to the Rock. The first several years would consist of 7-8 road games.
I could go on and on. The list of pros and cons is endless. But your point is well taken.
It appears that many of you are unaware of the NCAA moratorium on moves to the FBS level until 2011 based on your "play 12 I-A team" comments.
I'm aware of that, KMA, but that moratorium hasn't always been there. App had many years to make that decision. When Div I split in the late 70's, App made the conscious choice to move down - no one made them go to I-AA. Now you guys are saying "just give us the extra scholarships and BCS money" and we'll kick the ACC's butt."
Jerry Moore is a great coach and he understands the business of big time college football. He knows the score...Div IA would be the beginning of a slide for ASU football.
ASU could, right now, go maybe 7-5 against a CUSA-level schedule. Look at Marshall..they won a few IAA titles...where are they now?
WF Fan - ability to run, ability to pass, ability to be tough, ability to win big games, ability to make things happen. Good kid, good grades, leads by example - no doubt currently best QB in the Carolinas.
Several points to be made here:
1) How bad is the ACC that a freshman QB from a .500 team is 1st team All-Conference?
2) I've seen several hate-ments stating all App games are against "cupcakes" and we play in a JV league. That's fine. Petition your school to DROP their 22 best players and ALL your non-medical redshirts and come play our pee-wee ball in the SoCon (or CAA if you're really afraid). Let's see how you'd do, especially on those road games.
3) The second poster made the point that Wilson hadn't played a full season yet. Well, neither has Armanti Edwards.
4) NCSU fans should be thankful FCS even exists. Without it, you'd have a losing record. Matter of fact, ALL ACC fans should be thankful. Your record(s) would be even worse without those "JV" wins.
5)
"It misses the point. App chose to go to Div IAA back in the late 70's. They made that choice. No one made them take a scholarship reduction - perhaps they simply don't have the financial support to fund enough scholarships for a Div IA program. Wonder why, despite all their IAA titles and wins, they're still playing in a 25k seat stadium?
Join the FBS, you'll get the same share of BCS money as Sunbelt and CUSA teams."
That's a good point, but the issue is extremely complex. ASU would have to ask itself, "Which former I-AA champion would we resemble as an FBS team: a great Boise State team, a relatively obscure Marshall or Nevada, or an embarassment to its former self like Western Kentucky?" Most former FCS teams have struggled enormously, with extra exposure being perhaps the only redeeming quality.
There are many, many more layers to the issue. Yes, annual games against Marshall and ECU would be great, but C-USA would be more of a longshot. Compared to our current regular season, which is filled with deep-seated rivalries against schools which actually has students/alumni we personally know, a Sun Belt schedule against North Texas, MTSU, La.-Lafayette, and FIU would be a letdown. We know it'd take 10-15 years before an ACC or SEC team would man up enough to come to the Rock. The first several years would consist of 7-8 road games.
I could go on and on. The list of pros and cons is endless. But your point is well taken.
Would anyone else care to explain why it's "delusional" to suggest that Armanti Edwards (one the best QB's in FCS history), is the best QB in the Carolinas?
Is it delusional to say "Armanti Edwards' status among the greatest FCS QB's places him in the elite company of Tony Romo, Rich Gannon, and Steve McNair"?
Is it delusional to state "Last year's best ACC quarterback, Matt Ryan, was just a notch above last year's highest-drafted FCS quarterback"?
Is it delusional to highlight the fact that sometimes the Walter Payton award winner is not only better than the ACC's best player, but that he's better than the Heisman winner? (Steve McNair vs. Rashaam Salaam; Brian Westbrook vs. Eric Crouch)
Is it delusional to suggest that former NCSU players may actually know what they're talking about when they say Edwards is better than Wilson?
One more thing in regards to the smack about ASU being a "JV team"...
ASU is on an even, 63-scholarship playing field against all but two teams every year, with at least one of those games putting ASU at a 22-scholarship DISadvantage. In spite of those near-guarantee losses, ASU has more earned its past four postseason berths with 8-3, 10-1, 9-2, and 10-2 records.
State also is on a level, 85-scholarship playing field for all but one of its games, but that twelfth game is always one that puts them at a 22-scholarship ADvantage. So against teams on a level playing field, NCSU is 5-6, and yet they're postseason-bound.
Repeat: 5-6 against FBS competition, and NCSU is bound for a bowl game! Allowing THAT to happen is the only idea that's delusional.
"ASU could, right now, go maybe 7-5 against a CUSA-level schedule. Look at Marshall..they won a few IAA titles...where are they now?"
Throwaway statements like these are easy to make, but impossible to prove. It's pure speculation, based more on opinion than anything empirical.
We do know this:
ASU's Sagarin rating (thru 11/29) is 54. That put's ASU well within the top quarter of all 245 Divsion I football teams.
CUSA has exactly 1 team-- Tulsa, at 50-- with a higher Sagarin rating than ASU. East Carolina is 60, the aforementioned Marshall is 108.
Still, this has nothing to do with whether or not Armanti Edwards is the "best college quarterback in the carolinas". A lot of people think he is, myself included.
"ASU could, right now, go maybe 7-5 against a CUSA-level schedule. Look at Marshall..they won a few IAA titles...where are they now?" Now that is completely ridiculus to argue this as a FCS only argument. Where is Notre Dame now, where has Nebraska been, where is Michigan, where was Florida State a few years ago, for that matter .... where has my team (NCSU) been? All teams go through cycles of greatness and there are many reasons why. That is not a relevant argument on what ASU COULD do at the FBS level. Besides, they can't FBS schools to play them now, we (NCSU) won't play em, UNC ducked em big time, and Jim Grobe has been very public here in Winston that there is no way no time, as long as he is the coach, will he play ASU. "Schedule 12 FBS schools and then talk" How ignorant is that, they can barely get 1 FBS team to schedule them, how they hell can they get 12?? I spoke with guys in out FB Admin and they have said the same thing Grobe did. Jerry Moore is FCS's Pat Hill, "Anytime anywhere" and he has even less opportunities to play FBS schools. But this is about AE I have yet to hear one rational argument on why he isn't the best QB in the Carolinas. My boy Wilson may get there someday, but he's not there yet.
"1) How bad is the ACC that a freshman QB from a .500 team is 1st team All-Conference?"
~The ACC is the strongest its been in years. Don't take my word for it; read for yourself: http://www.fannation.com/si_blogs/the_sweep/posts/28041-conference-power-rankings-week-14?eref=fromSI
To answer your question on how a freshman earned All-ACC honors: first, the ACC QB crop is way down this year. Second, Wilson still deserves plenty of credit b/c he's had a stellar year. Third, that still does not mean he's outperformed Edwards.
"3) The second poster made the point that Wilson hadn't played a full season yet. Well, neither has Armanti Edwards."
~I think he meant that Wilson hasn't yet played a full season's WORTH of games (12 games). Armanti already has played 3 seasons' worth of games.
"4) NCSU fans should be thankful FCS even exists. Without it, you'd have a losing record. Matter of fact, ALL ACC fans should be thankful. Your record(s) would be even worse without those "JV" wins."
~State's the only ACC team that would have a losing record if you threw out the "JV games." Otherwise, you really should go to that link to see how well the ACC stacks up to the Big 12 and SEC this year. It's pretty impressive.
BigmanonCampus - that was the most well spoken, well-supported argument on the page. I will admit that irregardless isn't a word, but other than that, well said. I'm glad that you brought an argument with statistics and insight to the table, rather than the usual APP is BETTER than STATE, or a bunch of jokes about "pot-smoking Appalachian."
My biggest problem that I've had with State fans ever since I came to Appalachian is that no matter how good of a school App is, or how good our football program is, State fans REFUSE to listen to our statements and defenses. They absolutely shut down and one one thing echoes in their heads: "NC State is the best college ever to come into existance." I used to LOVE State as a kid, but I have recently turned to despising their students, their fans, and their college because of the continual display of ignorance and disregard for others (not only App).
Before I present any argument, I look up statistics, numbers, and ensure that I know what I'm talking about. I wish more people like you would look at the differences between Appalachian and NC State. There are very few. App has the highest CPA passer rating in North Carolina, graduates more teachers in the state than any other college (and we have half as many students as State), and has excelled in incoming SATs and GPAs for 3 years now.
To State fans: The mark of an educated, open-minded person is their ability to discuss intelligently and understand both sides of an argument. In everything but Engineering, Agriculture, and the level at which we play Football, Appalachian and NC State are on equal "playing fields."
Research. You're in the "research triangle" area right? Prove to me that you are intelligent and able to present an argument supported by (true) facts.
It is unfortunate that a discussion about football QBs had to be turned into another "State bashing everyone" discussion, leaving Appalachian supporters to defend our institution. State and App are both great universities, although I've never heard a true State fan admit that.
"For the Sate fans who believe their University's academics are much better than Appalachian's...I have several friends who applied to both State and Appalachian. They go to State now because they got rejected by Appalachian."
OK, if you say so.
Never forget only one team has brought home a National Championship in football in North Carolina....And has brought it home 3 times....In a row...
Two have been won by the QB this article is about...Can any other playcaller in the state say that?
Matthew and bigmanoncampus,
Excellent insight!
For what it's worth, my in-laws went to State, and I went to ASU. They have tremendous respect for App State as a school, although they think I'm completely ridiculous when I suggest that ASU might be able to beat them. They also snicker when I say that I like our chances against ECU next year. But I'm not sure that's an NC State thing. Like most casual college football fans who overlook the facts about FCS football, I think they're just brainwashed by a media and the overwhelming public perception that we're in a mere JV league. It's just so much easier to write off the Michigan game as a fluke rather than noticing that we didn't play our best game, Michigan didn't play their worst, and we STILL won. Oh well. Hopefully we'll beat ECU next year and prove that all college teams should recognize our success, but first we gotta take care of Richmond.
""For the Sate fans who believe their University's academics are much better than Appalachian's...I have several friends who applied to both State and Appalachian. They go to State now because they got rejected by Appalachian."
OK, if you say so."
I work in the Office of Admissions at Appalachian State, and this is a FACT. Absolute truth.
"""For the Sate fans who believe their University's academics are much better than Appalachian's...I have several friends who applied to both State and Appalachian. They go to State now because they got rejected by Appalachian."
OK, if you say so."
I work in the Office of Admissions at Appalachian State, and this is a FACT. Absolute truth."
I can attest to that too. One of my professors here at Ball State owns property in North Carolina, thus allowing his children in-state tuition and easier admission to UNC-system schools than students from outside NC. When I first met him I told him I went to ASU for undergrad, and he said, "My daughter applied to go there and she couldn't get in, and she's a good student! She had wanted to go there for years." Turns out she was able to get into Virginia Tech--as an out-of-state student--but not into ASU... Yes, I say so.
Keep on ignoring the truth and dishing out those baseless hillbilly school comments, State fans, if it helps you cope with your inferiority complex with UNC.
"~State's the only ACC team that would have a losing record if you threw out the "JV games." Otherwise, you really should go to that link to see how well the ACC stacks up to the Big 12 and SEC this year. It's pretty impressive."
Yeah, throw out the "JV" games it's real impressive. The ACC played 14 games against FCS teams (and transitional Western Kentucky):
overall that'd make THE ACC a fantastic 71-59 overall:
BC 8-3
Wake 7-5 (no FCS)
VPI 7-4
UNC-CH 7-4
Georgia Tech 7-3 (TWO FCS games)
FreeShoesU 6-4 (TWO FCS games)
Maryland 6-5
Miami 6-5
Clemson 6-5
NC State 5-6
Virginia 4-7
Duke 3-8
THE ACC would lose one bowl-eligible team, and countless million$ from being dropped to even lower-tiered bowls due to the lesser amount of wins.
Sure, THE ACC has been sensational against SEC and Big XII. Let's see who you beat:
Colorado 5-7 (outscored on avg by 10+ pts)
Vanderbilt 6-6
South Carolina 7-5
Mississippi State 4-8 (outscored by almost 2-1)
Georgia 9-3 (good one here)
Texas A&M 4-8 (outscored by 10+ ppg)
Nebraska 8-4 (good one)
Baylor 4-8
Ole Miss 8-4(good one)
that's 55-53. Impressive.
Care to reminisce over your losses?
Average 2007 Freshman SAT
NC State 1174
App St 1163
Wow those are great SAT scores! I couldn't have gotten into either school. Shall we compare the two QB's GPA and SAT scores??? I mean what the fox is everyone talking academics for? I thought this was about which QB is the best in the Carolinas, but then again reading comprehension never was my strong suit.
As of right now, there is no comparison, Armanti is the best QB based on his accomplishments thus far in his career. Maybe this topic can be revisited when both QB's college careers are complete.
NCSU = N-orth C-arolina's S-orriest U-niversity
You are all talk, and your coach is all talk.
Just look at the numbers, and the case is put to rest.
Our QB is better than your best
His rating is better
His quick is better
His arm is better
His read is better
His team is better
His school is better
His better is better
If state were ACTUALLY so confident in some "superiority" in NC, they wouldn't have to defend it left and right by running their mouths off; the team would tell the story. Problem is... that isn't the case.
"Average 2007 Freshman SAT
NC State 1174
App St 1163"
Eleven whole points' difference on the SAT? Isn't that about one question's worth of difference?
I guess I'm convinced now. NC State will soon become the first public and first non-northeastern school to be extended an invitation to the Ivy League. I guess means poor lil' App is just a community college for feeble-minded after all.
Enough of this academic nonsense. I want to see a State or Carolina fan make a case for why Yates or Russell is better than Edwards--without reverting to "he's minor league" garbage.
Stan Olsen:
THANK YOU!!! That guy (Armanti Edwards) in Boone does not get enough recognition. I've been watching him for 3 years now, and the scary thing is that he has improved every year. You are a wise man Mr. Olse
State Fans:
(How about this one)
N-ot C-lever or S-mart enough for U-NC
(and the state girls I see in Raleigh are definitely)N-ot C-ute or S-mart just U-gly
Don't be mad just because an unbiased source (i.e. not your boneheaded and arrogant coach) said APP STATE has the best of something in NC football. Armanti Edwards simply is... the Be(a)st.
Anon at 2:50 p.m.:
I am a State fan and graduate and admitted at 11:25 a.m. on this blog that both are good schools. I guess you didn't do your research. It's really sad to see so many people getting so worked up over this when both of these QBs deserve a huge pat on the back for doing great things for both of their teams. The thing that makes me proud to be a state fan is that no matter how great or how terrible of a year we are having, we're still proud to be cheering for our wolfpack. There is nothing wrong with being proud of the school you went to and the team that plays for it, but you don't have to kill on other people and their teams in the process. It's really a shame that people can't just admit that there are other schools that might be having a better year and be done with it.
Raleigh John: are you 12? That sounds like something a 12 year old made up. As a Carolina fan, I would be embarrassed to have you associated with other Carolina fans.
"NCSU = N-orth C-arolina's S-orriest U-niversity
You are all talk, and your coach is all talk."
~Dude, when you're accusing someone of being "all talk," don't turn around and insult an entire institution.
"His rating is better
His quick is better
His arm is better
His read is better
His team is better
His school is better
His better is better"
~I'm a proud ASU grad, but you can't back up any argument that ASU is a better overall school than NC State. In fact, you really can't even compare the two. Big research school versus smaller, more undergrad-focused school. Apples and oranges, man. Besides, your "school is better" comment does nothing but sour the other good points you made.
I don't think anyone (worth reading) has said that App is a BETTER school than State. All we are saying is that it's not nearly as bad as State students believe it is. It is nearly on the same level, with a fourth of the funding, half as many students, not to mention App has only been a part of the UNC system since 1972. The college has only been around for 109 years. We just wish State supporters could give App the respect for the institution that we are, an institution that is very close to passing State.
Armanti will prove he's the best QB in the state next September at ECU.
Jealousy is all it is. Our campus is prettier, yours makes you depressed on a daily basis, our professors are way up there on the awesome meter, and nobody chooses to go to state, it's a 3rd choice.
Pack, if you played us right now on a moments notice you would have no chance, app would embarrass you.
Finally, Armanti is one of THE MOST electrifying players in college football, and you are jealous that you can't hang out in the mountain week in and week out having the time of your life watching an incredible athlete.
Don't feel too bad though, there are plenty of American Eagles to go shopping for screen print t-shirts at around the area.
Matthew, I'm sorry if you feel that App doesn't get the respect it deserves. It's a great school. But I think you are making a blanket statement that State students and fans think App is so miserable, when in reality most of us spend time visiting friends there because we enjoy it. Just like a lot of our App friends come to Raleigh for good times when nothing is going on in Boone.
And Ian, I can assure you there is no issue of jealousy in this. But there is obviously an issue of an over-inflated head for you. I hope your App State hat is adjustable.
I'm aware of that, KMA, but that moratorium hasn't always been there. App had many years to make that decision. When Div I split in the late 70's, App made the conscious choice to move down - no one made them go to I-AA. Now you guys are saying "just give us the extra scholarships and BCS money" and we'll kick the ACC's butt."
Actually, you make a great point here. I mean after all, NC State gets the extra scholarships and bcs money, and they can't even finish with a winning record...
there would not be so much hate if there wasn't so much jealousy
so....jealous you are deep deep down, wouldn't it be nice to beat michigan, have articles written about your team in national newspapers...I think the USA Today has written more articles about us this year than in you entire football programs history.
I would not even post this if there weren't so many state fans insisting on bashing ASU based on jealousy and a game played two years ago where we were competitive without Armanti. I do believe this article is about Armanti. I have yet to meet a state fan who gave us the respect our team deserves. I know mediocrity is your game but don't hate on teams who choose to go for excellence.
I have seen both QB play in person on several occasions. Both are great in their respective offenses. Armanti is without a doubt the best as we speak. After the LSU game two of the LSU radio team members said that Armanti would start for all but two of the SEC schools this year!
>>>App fans, this is why you're beginning to push the annoyance level of UNC fans. Don't let your arrogance and over-inflated self opinion overrun the great team you guys have put together. App is a great 1-AA team, but the fact of the matter is that they could not play at the 1-A level week in and week out. Against LSU this year (a team that is only 7-5 overall), your team lost 41-13 while Edwards was 13-of-31 passing (29.5% comp.) for 155 yards and a touchdown and had 12 carries for 23 yards>>>
A lesson in humility from a Tarheel. Priceless.
LSU was the season opener, played under some very unusual circumstances. Tell me about UNC's record against SEC teams again. Why don't you heels take our scholarships and our budget and see what you can do with it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9t31HcoG3ME
""just give us the extra scholarships and BCS money" and we'll kick the ACC's butt."
"Actually, you make a great point here. I mean after all, NC State gets the extra scholarships and bcs money, and they can't even finish with a winning record...""
I'm making a point, but probably the point that you're trying to make. App had a chance to take those scholarships and some bcs money, but turned it down in exchange for running up their winning percentage against 2nd rate teams. They (App) want those outside their program to respect them like they're a winning IA program, but they're not. That respect has to be earned by playing good teams week-end and week-out. App wants to hold on to its security blanket (the SoCon and IAA) while proclaiming greatness.
Ian, you sound like a very bitter individual. You lost by 30 to a mediocre D1 school. You beat Elon by 10 points at home. App would finish 2-10 if they played our schedule. If you want respect it's time to play varsity and get off JV.
All of you unlit ACC light bulbs have forgotten one thing. ASU is ranked 53th in the Sagarin ratings this week......ahead of some your second tier teams....So, now, tell me. Armanti could not be candidate for best QB in the State??
Don't insult my intelligence.
I hate when people join the conversation without reading everything we've already said.
"I'm making a point, but probably the point that you're trying to make. App had a chance to take those scholarships and some bcs money, but turned it down in exchange for running up their winning percentage against 2nd rate teams. They (App) want those outside their program to respect them like they're a winning IA program, but they're not. That respect has to be earned by playing good teams week-end and week-out. App wants to hold on to its security blanket (the SoCon and IAA) while proclaiming greatness."
1) Where did you find this information?
2) It doesn't matter, because it's not true
3) We don't have the facilities (yet) to join the FBS.
4) We haven't even APPLIED to join the FBS because it's closed through 2011
Don't state things you don't know about, because that is lying.
And once again, it's not JV. James Madison is ranked above NC State in the Sagarin rating, and we lost to them by only 3 (not to mention we beat them in the playoffs last year).
If I said, "A high school QB threw for 4,000 yards this season," and you said, "well he's in high school, he's not in college," that would be a stupid statement.
The same applies here. Armanti is in the FCS, and EVERYONE else he plays with is in the FCS, and he STILL has the numbers that he has. He is a GREAT QB, and playing in a "lesser" division doesn't take that away.
Don't listen to Ian, he's an idiot.
App JV? I think NCSU should move down to FCS where they can compete.
Sept 6: NCSU scores 34 vs. William & Mary.
Nov 15: JMU scores 48 vs. William & Mary.
Poor little Wuf has a two touchdown deficit. (With 22 more scholarships)
All you ignorant dumb asses who keep saying Armanti got hurt against Michigan need to get your facts straight. Google it yourselves...Armanti was hurt in the preseason! That's how big of a beast he is. Armanti's so hood he loves pain.
He plays hurt and leads his team to victory over Michigan in the Big House. Yeah that Michigan team that went on to beat Tim Tebow's Florida Gators in the Capital One Bowl. Stop hatin and get your AD to put Armanti on your schedule...y'all lil sissy ass 6-6 WolfPackers.
The complete ignorance shown here by a majority of NC State fans is amazing. It says volumes about the level of football knowledge on the part of their fan base. I should know since my brother, who never set foot on the Raleigh campus, is a die-hard NC State fan. Guys, why don't you attempt to build up Wilson with compelling arguements, instead of trying to make SASU sound small-time by trashing ASU and the their competition. Does it make you guys feel a big and poweerful when you trash another school? Honestly, it sounds like a severe case of insecurity to me. Yea, NC State really pounded ASU back in 2005. Thirteen whole points and we gave you 9 or 'em. BTY, you guys can cease with the "too little to take the pounding in FBS" stuff. Edwards was hurt the week prior to the Michigan game (and still played exceptionally well) and was not hurt at LSU. He only missed the WCU game, which was 11 after LSU. My fellow Mountaineers, I suggest you refrain from getting sucked into this pool of negativity. It just isn't worth the effort.
The stats that matter!
Edwards' completion % = 64.2%
Wilson's completion % = 55.2%
Edwards' avg yards per pass = 9.7
Wilson's avg yards per pass = 7.0
Either Edwards is a more accurate passer or FCS receivers are better than BCS receivers.
For NC State's sake, and the ACC as a whole, I hope Wilson develops into an "Armanti" style quarterback. Maybe ACC football would become exciting again.
Matthew:
As I've said before, that moratorium hasn't always been in existence. App could have sacked up anytime in the late 70's, 80's, and 90's and decided to play big-time football.
Now that there is a moratorium, you want to complain about the "establishment" keeping you guys out, stripping you of BCS money and scholarships that you'd otherwise have. It's a self-imposed crutch. App wouldn't join FBS right now if it could, because it's level of fan support puts right smack in the middle of the Sunbelt conference. And in the Sunbelt conference, there won't be any more 10-1 records.
Never forget only one team has brought home a National Championship in football in North Carolina....And has brought it home 3 times....In a row...
Two have been won by the QB this article is about...Can any other playcaller in the state say that?
And somewhere fans are raving about how their team's qb is the best in the state because their team won the Div. III title.
Once again, no proof exists that App even had the opportunity to join FBS in the 70's, 80's, or 90's. For a team to move up in the division there are certain requirements they must meet. One of the first is facilities. Until now (next year), App has never had proper facilities or funding. We've always been a good team, but it's such a small market in such a competitive state that it's never been taken seriously until recently. When Marshall moved up they were MUCH bigger than App. Now I believe we could survive in the FCS, but up until the last few seasons we wouldn't have been taken seriously if we applied to move up.
Personally, I would hate to move up. I enjoy playoffs and enjoy the smaller feel of our team. I know it's inevitable though.
"As I've said before, that moratorium hasn't always been in existence. App could have sacked up anytime in the late 70's, 80's, and 90's and decided to play big-time football."
~For someone who acts as though he couldn't possibly be wrong, I'm amazed you'd say App could have moved up in the late 70's, considering that THEY WERE A 1-A TEAM IN THE LATE 70's. The entire Southern Conference moved from 1-A to 1-AA in 1982 because the NCAA mandated that 1-A programs have a minimum stadium capacity of 30,000, which none of the SoCon schools had until Marshall expanded their stadium in the mid-90's in preparation for their 1-A move.
Throughout the 80's and 90's, the NCAA's stadium capacity rule remained in place. ASU had neither the ticket sales nor the financial means to increase its capacity until very recently and thus has been unable to "sack up" to 1-A.
(By the way, I hope you're not one of those morons who believes that 1-A requirements has ever had anything to do with student enrollment. Wake Forest and Tulsa are smaller than most 1-AA schools. It has to do with ticket sales, or, in other words, MONEY.)
In addition, moving up to 1-A would require not just funding for 22 more football scholarships, but due to Title IX, it would also require funding for 22 more scholarships for women's sports, funding for equipment & coaches' salaries for those new women's sports, and funding for increased salaries required for 1-A football coaches. Throughout the 80's and 90's, none of that was remotely possible for App State.
Early this decade, the rule for becoming 1-A changed from minimum stadium capacity to a minimum average attendance of 15,000 over a rolling two-year period. App started meeting that attendance mark in 2005 (first half of the rolling two-year period), met it again in 2006 (second half of the two-year period), and, of course, the moratorium went into effect in 2007.
So, in stark contrast to your claims, ASU has never been able to "sack up" and go 1-A, first because it didn't meet the stadium capacity requirements, then because it hadn't established a minimum average attendance over a two-year period, and now because of the moratorium.
After pouring in $50 million to facility improvements, it's very questionable ASU boosters would be willing to provide the funding for a 1-A move at this point, especially when they're probably more worried about their 401(k)'s becoming 201(k)'s.
"Now that there is a moratorium, you want to complain about the "establishment" keeping you guys out, stripping you of BCS money and scholarships that you'd otherwise have. It's a self-imposed crutch. App wouldn't join FBS right now if it could, because it's level of fan support puts right smack in the middle of the Sunbelt conference. And in the Sunbelt conference, there won't be any more 10-1 records."
~NOBODY has EVER claimed that the "establishment" is keeping us down or that anyone is "stripping us of BCS money." Believe it or not, we actually enjoy winning national titles, and we'll be more than happy to keep doing that between now and the expiration of the moratorium. Now if ASU keeps its attendance up and the leadership makes the conscientious decision to move to 1-A in 2011, it will.
I don't complain about the fact that ASU doesn't receive money from the BCS the way State does; however; it's absurd to suggest that when any any 1-A team defeats a 1-AA team at home, as that's the only venue where those games every happen, that the 1-A team's adavantages in scholarship players and financial backing has nothing to do with it. 1-A teams have million-dollar coaches, pristine facilities & weight rooms, exposure on TV, everything they could ask for, not to mention home field every single time they face a 1-AA team. I mean, the disadvantages are so great that most of the country had never even HEARD of ASU before the Michigan game. There's not a single 1-AA team that should come within 30 points of a 1-A team, yet we only lost 23-10 to a team that absolutely could not afford to its "little brother," we defeated a team with one of the wealthiest financial backings in college football, and we lost 41-13 to a 7-5 LSU team. Before criticizing that score, think about what the 85-scholarship State team did at the South Carolina team that also lost to LSU.
The issues of moving up to 1-A or not are extremely complex. Since you didn't even know that ASU has only been eligible to move up to 1-A football since 2005
"And somewhere fans are raving about how their team's qb is the best in the state because their team won the Div. III title."
If you're comparing Armanti Edwards to a D-III quarterback, you're sorely mistaken. Someone prove me if I'm wrong, but I don't think there's ever been a D-III quarterback to make headlines in a national newspaper or to make the NFL.
AE is not the first great QB to play at this level. In fact, 4 of the past 10 NFL MVP's played QB at the 1-A level. The best quarterback to come out of the 1995 draft was Steve McNair from 1-AA school Alcorn State.
That reminds me: If you need further evidence that being a great 1-A quarterback means you're a great college quarterback, period, look at the starters from Super Bowl XXXIV: Kurt Warner and Steve McNair.
It's not an insult to Russell Wilson to suggest that he's not as good as Armanti Edwards. What is insulting is to compare Armanti Edwards to a Division III player.
A joke huh? What about Armanti is a joke? The joke is NC State fans thinking that RW is the best quarterback in NC. He is a great young talent and I am sure he will have a great career, but let's exam the FCS vs. F"BS" arguement most ignorant fans use in this debate.
1. Ryan Perrilloux-A great player at LSU, and a great amateur boxer at nightclubs. However, he has not accomplished near the feats that Armanti has at the same level, period. Is his team even in the playoffs? NO.
2. Armnati makes FCS competition look bad when he is 100%. He rushed for over 300+ yards in a playoff game last season. Last week, he passed for over 400 yards; in a playoff game. He can do it running and passing. Oh, and just try to sack him. The play of the game last week against SC State consisted of Edwards' elusivness and will to win as he escaped pressure to complete a pass that turned out to be a backbreaker of a third down conversion. Oh, and it was a playoff game.
3. Edwards has become a smaller version of Tebow. Not because he can run and pass in the spread offense, but because he runs people over at only 190 lbs. Just reference the Georgia Southern highlights from this season and watch Edwards run over Eagles on his way to the endzone.
4. No hype, no problem. UNC fans probably want to take back the Heisman talk they bestowed upon Mike Paulus. RW will have massive hype the rest of his team will not let him live up to next season. Tyrod Taylor stays injured (VTech, but still overhyped ACC quarterback). Thaddeus Lewis plays for Duke,'nuff said. ECU choked on the pressure of two minor upsets to start the season. And finally, Riley Skinner proved he was not the coolest customer in the pocket with his decision making this season. Armanti, with no hype out of high school, has gone to a program that was already championship caliber and took over the starting job from a good quarterback (Elder) and has only elevated the team and the entire FCS with his play and his winniner's mentality. Maybe UNC fans would like to trade Paulus and ND fans would like to trade Claussen for a split season with Edwards. At least then all the hype the bestow on these garbage players might make sense. Catholic league players are overhyped guys, learn to scout outside of Parade Magazine.
5. Finally, Edwards just wins. He plays hurt and wins. He always delivers the play asked for and then is always humble afterwards. A few weeks ago, Edwards was flipped on his head on a run near the sidelines (a hit that may have ended Tyrod Taylor's season). Edwards promptly popped up and looked to the crowd and did his patented arm wave to signal that he loves to play football and loves to be hit, but he also loves to do the hitting. It does not matter if it is FCS or F"BS". A winner is a winner. Two of the best players in NFL, and football history, were FCS players. Those men were Walter Payton and Jerry Rice. They were winners, and Armanti has their spirit and ability.
So, in summary, all fans of NC college football should be proud of their quarerbacks. Get excited over the fact that you will be playing in a bowl game with a sponsor like Wings-to-Go or the "Blue Turf" bowl. App State will be playing for a chance at immortality. The FCS champ will be determined on the field, not on a computer much like the one you are reading this on. 10 years ago, who would have thought Boise State would be where they are now? Just ask Oklahoma. App State may not ever make the jump to F"BS", but never call them or any team that takes the field "cupcakes". That's how you lose to a "cupcake" when you are ranked 5th in the country. Just ask any Michigan fan.
"Once again, no proof exists that App even had the opportunity to join FBS in the 70's, 80's, or 90's. For a team to move up in the division there are certain requirements they must meet. One of the first is facilities."
~App was 1-A until 1982.
Here's proof that App did NOT have the opportunity to join FBS in the 80's or 90's: they didn't meet the minimum stadium capacity requirement of 30,000. In that time period, App had neither the money to expand nor any indication that enough tickets could be sold to justify expansion. That minimum capacity rule has since been thrown out.
Currently the requirements are to have a minimum average attendance or ticket sales over a two year period of 15,000. Literally as soon as ASU met that requirement, the moratorium went into effect.
Theoretically, ASU could move up without having to give out 85 scholarships, but they'd be stupid if they did.
"When Marshall moved up they were MUCH bigger than App. Now I believe we could survive in the FCS, but up until the last few seasons we wouldn't have been taken seriously if we applied to move up."
~If you're talking about the size of Marshall's enrollment, that has nothing to do with it. But I believe their school is still larger than ASU.
I don't know who you mean by "we wouldn't have been taken seriously." If we had met the guidelines and applied, we'd have gone 1-A. It's not as though there's a limited number of spots avaialable in 1-A. They already have 119! Now if we were applying to a new conference, then, yes, it might have been hard for ASU to be taken seriously.
"Personally, I would hate to move up. I enjoy playoffs and enjoy the smaller feel of our team. I know it's inevitable though."
~It's far from inevitable. There are plenty of drawbacks to moving up, as 2002 1-AA champion Western Kentucky has shown us this year. They are absolutely horrible, which hurts tickets sales. And considering that increased ticket sales is a major reason for going 1-A, their move is quite questionable.
Ken Peacock and the Board of Trustees are very aware of the drawbacks. Unlike some other universities' leaders whose judgments are blinded by the glamour of the FBS, ASU leaders wouldn't take away our opportunity to compete in the playoffs or our rivalries against Western, Furman, Georgia Southern, JMU, etc., unless they had absolute confidence we'd succeed in the FBS. And they'd have the studies to back up their decision.
Is Russell Wilson better than Kurt Warner just because Wilson plays against the ACC and Warner played against 1-AA teams?
No.
Is Russell Wilson better than Rich Gannon just because Wilson plays against the ACC and Gannon played against 1-AA teams?
No.
Is Russell Wilson better than Joe Flacco just because Wilson plays against the ACC and Flacco played against 1-AA teams?
No.
Is Russell Wilson better than Steve McNair just because Wilson plays against the ACC and McNair played against 1-AA teams?
No.
Is Russell Wilson better than Tony Romo just because Wilson plays against the ACC and Romo played against 1-AA teams?
No.
So why is Russell Wilson better than Armanti Edwards just because he plays in the ACC?
(By the way, of all those great former 1-AA quarterbacks, only Steve McNair had better stats, but then again Armanti still has another year to go. None of them won 2 national titles. None of them beat a team like Michigan. But all of them, like Edwards, were better than Russell Wilson.)
Matthew, reveal yourself to us since you work in Admissions, because I don't know of a Matthew that works there.
If anyone may be lying here, it may be you.
Matthew, if you work in admissions, who are you?
Why would I lie about that? I'm not going to give my last name... and I do work in Admissions. I'm a student.
Not to mention if you know everyone in Admissions, then I assume that you're associated with Appalachian, which means you shouldn't be accusing me of lying, because you should agree with me.
What are Edwards stats against I-A competition, I think thats the only fair way to compare. Why didnt the reporter state those stats?
Additionally, for those calling out I-A schools for not playing App. I agree if those schools are playing I-AA games against out of region competition-like UNC playing McNeese State. Give some props to ECU, because when they did schedule I-AA, which they normally dont, they did schedule App.
Edwards is garbage
gg App fans. Keep up that inferiority complex. It suits you well. Maybe in a couple more years you'll be able to beat Marcus Stone
Classy...
Great performance by Edwards. How many picks did he throw against a horrible FCS defense? Its ok App fans, keep making redneck jokes about the Wolfpack, they'll just keep beating every team in the state
Redneck comments?
First INT: Receiver knocked the (catchable) ball and it got picked.
Second INT: Receiver tripped on DBs legs in end zone and it got picked.
Third INT: Armanti got hit from behind and ball got knocked into the air.
Fourth INT: Legitimate INT.
Fifth INT: Last second hail mary to the endzone desperation pass.
The first 3 weren't his fault. The last one happened because we were trying to score late in the game.
Richmond DOES have a good defense, and they play in the hardest FCS conference.
It's hardly Armanti's fault that we lost. He had no time to throw because of an offensive line that didn't hold up very well. His receivers didn't play like they should have (dropped passes, fumbles).
EVERY aspect of App played poorly last Saturday, and you can't dumb it down to the performance of just one player, no matter what the stat sheet says.
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